Z/28
 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX6Bsp3hgEU

-Alex

Wow, this car ran a 7:37:470 at the Ring!

-Alex

Its def a fast car. But it better be for more than the price of a GT500 with no A/C or Radio...

Why do people get hung up on the A/C and radio thing for a track oriented car? The car clearly isn't meant to be a daily driver luxury car. Most hardcore racers remove those items anyway if the car has it.

-Alex

Because Racecar:winner_first_h4h:

This is going to upset all of the Ford elitests but, just sayin...

40. Camaro Z/28 7:37.47 162 '13 507 / 1702
53. Ford GT 7:40.60 161 '04 550 / 1538

-Alex

Tech in 2013> Tech in 2004

I understand why it doesnt have radio or A/C but people compare it to the Boss and its not even in the same catigory. A Boss, even the LS, is a track capable street car. the new Z/28 is a track car that you can get to pass inspection to drive on the street. still cant outrun that ugly, dont matter how fast it is

True. I'm still not sold on the look. It kinda looks bloated to me. I was hoping the new changes would make it more trim, like what Ford did with the Mustang in 2010 as opposed to the blocky-looking style.

-Alex

I got a feeling that the new stangs are gonna be pretty quick around a track. Hell, if they can make a Live rear axle car handle what can they do with IRS and 600 less lbs?

Probably cause the cost. Yeah you gotta pay to play but I think no ac and radio standard would go over better if it was between the ss and zl1 price wise

Not in the same category? I guess that depends on what personal category you come up with for each car. I see both as limited production, purpose built track pony cars, so they are absolutely in that same category.

Both have:

Limited production numbers
Track oriented engines
Naturally aspirated, high revving engines
Track tuned suspension
Better brakes that their more streetable counterparts
Weight savings
Upgraded aero
Cost more

-Alex

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tv8I...=youtube_gdata

-Alex

like I said the boss is a street car that is capible at the track, IE has a radio, a/c, sync, etc. The Z28 is a track car, no creature comforts, that passes inspection so you can also drive on the street. The Boss is very easily a daily driver car where as unless you live in a perfect climate and dont listen to radio, the z/28 would be a horrible daily driver. PLUS its about $25k more than the boss.....

Price has nothing to do with how streetable (or trackable for that matter) a car may or may not be, so that factor is is more or less dependent on how much your income is and your budget.

Besides, it's not like you can't add AC and a radio when buying a Z/28, so really that point doesn't really seem feasible. If Chevy was saying "No we will not for any reason install AC or a radio", then I could see your argument legitimately. But since both cars can be bought with AC and a radio, kind of a wash.

Here's a USED 2012 Boss 302 LS for $47,000.
http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-s...gIndex=9&Log=0

-Alex

and Gary bought his used 2012 Boss LS for $40,000.... not sure what your point is? I'm still not sure what you are trying to argue here. We all agree that the z/28 is a fast car but once again it is 25k more expensive than a Boss was brand new so I would expect it to be faster.

My point is that both cars are in the same category. Your arguments that they are not are because A) no AC or radio and B) price. As stated, I don't see that being valid when you can get a Z/28 with both AC and a radio to make the car as comfortable as a Boss 302 and people have paid upwards of $50k for the Boss 302. So that makes both cars equal performers in price and comfort.

-Alex

listen...it took GM 3 yrs to play ball with with the Boss and the GT500 was king off the muscle cars for 4 yrs. Bottom line, this generation is over. Better cars are less than 3 yrs away and the Z/28 cant even be bought until March 2014!!!!!!! I take my hats off to GM for even building the car but its purely for bragging rights since the cars isnt SCCA or Grand AM compatible. Also this car is Not in the same category as the Boss due to the lack of sound deadening and thin glass. This car is closer to a Boss S than LS. Last, GM thinks this car is an engineering marvel. Its nothing but a street legal Camaro GS.R which has been around for yrs! check the specs!

I respected your post up until this Okay, so we've gone from "it's not in the same class because no AC or radio" when you can buy a Z/28 with both, to now it's not in the same class because of thin glass or sound deadening? Are you serious? No one in the Corvette community or any other forum I've been on has ever made this many excuses. C5Zs had thinner glass for windshields when comparing them to Porsche turbos, Ferrari 360s etc. No one in those forums complains about pricing either. If the car performs, it performs.

What's the next excuse? Oh, GM uses a different paint code, so it's not in the same category? Disregard all of the blatant similarities and the fact that both cars are built for the track, if the car doesn't give you a BJ then it's not in the same category.

-Alex

how does price not make them in different categories? Some have paid as much as $50k for a boss and that is still $20k less than a z28, huge price difference. So I guess we should start comparing the z28 to cars like the 2010 ACR Viper which is a lot faster than the z28 and you can get one for around $80k. While we are at it heck lets compare the mustang with a Ferrari and talk about why the Ferrari is better. Price absolutely makes a difference and when a price difference is $25k on the sticker prices then yea I say different class.

I'm getting deja' vu from this thread.

Ive always considered Porsche the best drivers car. That being said the Z28 is impressive but at the sametime I have to wonder if Ford can do that much with a LRA (boss, LS) what are they gna do with a IRS? It should be impressive to say the least. The fact the Z28 is being compared to a car with a LRA is pretty funny.

Post a link showing a window sticker of a Z/28 please.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gc-T--DI0qQ

Go to 8:55. He says it will go for "north of $56k", I don't assume that means $80,000.00. Where are you you seeing window stickers for $80k Z/28s?

You know a Viper and a Camaro are different cars completely. A Viper is a two-seat sports car. Let's keep on track comparing pony cars to pony cars :).

Listen to what the chief engineer says at 2:45.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gc-T--DI0qQ
I'll just go ahead and type it. "Up level stereo is not standard." Now I don't know what that means to you but, that to me, means that it does come with a stereo, just not the higher output one. So, toss the stereo argument out the door.

-Alex

Dealer mark up. You can count on that, maybe not 80 but i can see 65k to 70k.

Oh I am certain there will be dealer markup. But is it fair to say that because some Boss 302s were selling for $60k, that all of them are $60k cars due to dealer markup?

-Alex

Ford has done some magic with the LRA even on the non LS cars. Also it is funny that GMs pony car will be slaughtering many higher end cars on a track that the Germans own.

-Alex

Id pretty much say that. They only built 2k. Unless you know where you could find one new for less?

Gm is not my fav company. Not because of the cars but its because they owe the Tax payers a shit ton of money. They keep building these niche cars they need to be selling volume. There new truck is behind the Fseries still and its brand new!

Dealer markup doesn't represent the price of the car. The MSRP is the actual vehicle price. Factoring dealer markup as the car's price is just like including the cost of an extended warranty or GAP.


We all knew that. And that is perfectly fine. I don't have a favorite manufacturer, there are just cars that I do and don't like across the board. Some are built by Ford, some from GM, some from Toyota.

-Alex

I stated the reason I dont. They build some fast cars but thats my only gripe. As far as the sticker goes for dealer markup you cant remove it like gap or a warranty. They car will sell for that or it will sit because they jknow someone will pay that.

The dealer will remove it when/if a car doesn't sell. For those that order cars, you don't go on the manufacturer's website and choose to add in a dealer markup. You choose the car, options, and bam, there's your price. You just go to the dealership and pick it up. But I do get your point about GAP and an extended warranty. So let's say, state taxes and registration. You can't avoid those, but those items don't represent the actual price of the car.

If you go to a dealership and ask "How much is this car?" they will refer you to the sticker and then say "but we are selling it for this amount.

Price($56,000) + markup($4,000) doesn't equal price. It just means you paid $60,000 for a $56,000 car. The price and what you pay for the car are not the same thing.

-Alex

Im not saying it is. Im saying thats what your going to pay, unless you find a dealer that is willing to sell it to you at cost. Shelby's are going through the samething.

Exactly, we are on the same page :).

My point was never, what someone chooses to pay for it. It was always, the actual price of the car, which was the debate.

-Alex

I probally should of said MSRP instead of cost. ehhhh:Boo:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R3VlFXABzyc

No back seat, reduced interior comfort like the Z/28 i.e. track car.
Basic radio (just like Z/28).
Comes with a special key that adjusts engine parameters for the track i.e. track car.

So I guess in one perspective the Z/28 is more of a daily driver car since it has a back-seat.

Only 1000 laguna were ever produced. Its just funny to me that they compare it to a LRA car. Lol

Camaros and Mustangs have been direct competitors for decades.

-Alex

Im waiting for the new stangs to cone out. Its gna be 600lbs lighter. Weight is everything.

From Chevrolet.com

"
SACRIFICE ALL IN THE NAME OF PERFORMANCE.


The legendary Camaro Z/28 is back for the 2014 model year. Originally introduced in 1967, Camaro Z/28 was designed specifically to compete in the Sports Car Club of America's Trans-Am 2 class. Lightweight, nimble and incredibly powerful, the original Z/28 was designed ideally for road racing. The 2014 Z/28 carries the same racing credentials, running a lap around the Nürburgring track with an impressive 7:37.40 time in inclement weather.

POWERTRAIN


A hand-assembled LS7 engine powers the Camaro Z/28, boasting an incredible 505 horsepower and 481 lb.-ft. of torque, making it the most powerful normally aspirated regular production small block V8 ever. The highest-quality parts and precision assembly elevate the redline level to 7000 rpm.


Durable, lightweight components such as titanium intake valves and connecting rods coupled with a forged-steel crankshaft make the LS7 engine incredibly robust. The standard 10.5-quart, dry-sump oil system distributes pressurized oil from an external reservoir to protect vital components under high-g driving conditions.

The LS7 is mated to a TREMEC® TR6060 6-speed manual gearbox that features close-ratio gearing - optimized for the engine’s power characteristics. The TREMEC is coupled with a 5.1:1-ratio short-throw shifter to ensure quick and precise shifts

Power is distributed to the rear wheels via a limited-slip differential, which features a helical gear set rather than traditional clutch packs that continuously adjusts torque bias allowing drivers to confidently lay down more power to get through corners faster. Coupled with the Performance Traction Management (PTM) system, drivers can adjust the level of throttle and brake intervention to match their capability and driving environment, essentially making PTM custom to each driving situation.

Z/28 features a cooling system designed for the track — standard. This incorporates the dry-sump oil system of the LS7, which connects to an integral liquid-to-liquid cooling system for engine oil. Another liquid-to-liquid system provides cooling for the transmission and differential.

BODY


The 2014 Camaro Z/28 pays homage to the exterior of the original legend while capitalizing on 21st century design elements and technology. Z/28 was born to be a functional instrument for the track, utilizing best practices and influences learned through racing.

Camaro Z/28 has aerodynamic treatments designed to produce downforce — specifically at track speeds. A large splitter connects to an underbody panel to further reduce lift. Fender flares over the front and rear wheels and extended rocker panels contribute to aerodynamic stability. Z/28 also features an aggressive rear spoiler and functional diffuser to complete the fully integrated aerodynamic package.

CHASSIS


The tires on Camaro Z/28 are robust and massive Pirelli® PZERO™ Trofeo R† 305/30ZR19 summer-only tires† — ideal for lateral motions, like corner entry and exit.

Camaro Z/28 features lightweight Brembo® carbon Ceramic Matrix™ rotors and fixed, monoblock calipers. The huge 394 x 36 mm front rotors are paired with 6-piston calipers, while the 390 x 32 mm rear rotors are paired with 4-piston calipers. Compared to similar-size two-piece steel rotors, the lightweight and large carbon calipers save 22 pounds, while encouraging impressive stopping power and heat toleration — ideal for track use.

Camaro Z/28 is one of the first production cars to feature race-proven spool-valve dampers. The spool-valve damper allows 4-way adjustment to precisely tune both bump and rebound settings for high-speed and low-speed wheel motions. The wider tuning range dramatically increases the damper stiffness on Camaro Z/28 without significantly impacting ride quality.

INTERIOR


The all-new driver and front passenger racing seats are designed by RECARO®. Aggressive bolsters ensure both passenger and driver remain firmly planted, even in high-energy driving situations. A flat-bottom steering wheel opens leg room for entry and exit, as well as quicker heel/toe shifting. A short-throw shifter allow for rapid, confident shifting."

-Alex

Cant wait for that new all motor shelby. Then ford will own that as well lol.

The Boss LS is street car that can be raced on the track. The Z/28 is track car that can be licensed on the street. They are truly 2 different classes of car. That's just my opinion.

So now lets look at some factual stuff rather than a bunch of opinions. Grab a Boss 302 S (or BOSS 302 R) and put it side by side with the Z/28. They have the same options. See for yourself. The only difference is a roll cage. Again, the Z/28 is nothing but a street legal GS.R with optional AC and a little bit of interior. So I'm impressed by the official lap times of the Z/28, but I'm also not surprised since I see this caliber of car race on Fox Sports once a month.

And again this generation is over! No one is going to challenge GM and this car simply because they have moved on. GM better start working on that Alpha platform rather than building special edition track cars at the end of it's generation.

http://www.fordracingparts.com/compe...osscompare.asp

Bottom line, the car is a beast but I'm not impressed because I've already seen what a stripped down version of the car could do. That's my spill on this subject. I'm moving on because December is real close!!!!

Good post. I believe the new mustang is gonna be a force to be reckoned with.